Callinan quizzed on whether he made derogatory remarks about McCabe

By Gerard Cunningham

 

Former garda commissioner Martin Callinan had told the Charleton tribunal it was "absolutely false" that he told John McGuinness TD that whistleblower Sgt Maurice McCabe had "abused his family".

The tribunal is examining allegations by former garda press officer Supt David Taylor that he was directed by Mr Callinan to brief the media negatively on Sgt McCabe.

In January 2014, Mr Callinan appeared before the Oireachtas Public Accounts Committee (PAC), and was questioned about the penalty points scandal.

Mr Callinan met with committee chairman Mr McGuinness the following day in the car park of a Dublin hotel. Mr McGuinness said that during the meeting, Mr Callinan said that Sgt McCabe had "abused his family" and was being investigated, and inquiries were at an advanced stage.

"That is absolutely false, Chairman. I never under any circumstances said anything of that nature," Mr Callinan said.

Mr Callinan said that Mr McGuinness was already aware of an allegation which was investigated in 2006, following which the DPP directed no prosecution.

"It was quite clear to me that prior to our meeting Mr McGuinness was aware that Sgt McCabe had been investigated. And all he was speaking about was an allegation. There was no investigation in any shape or form," Mr Callinan said.

Mr Callinan said that Mr McGuinness asked him why was it that Sgt McCabe was raising these issues, and asked, "Was it because of the file that went to the DPP?"

Mr Callinan said he indicated that if Mr McGuinness knew about the investigation, then he knew the DPP's direction.

"He indicated that he knew all about the investigation," Mr Callinan said.

 

Reason

Mr Callinan said he did not say anything derogatory about Sgt McCabe during the meeting, and his reason for the meeting was that he was concerned about a planned public appearance of Sgt McCabe before the PAC as he did not believe it was the correct forum.

Mr Callinan said Mr McGuinness was making "outrageously serious allegations” made against him, adding “I cannot for the life of me understand why they have been made."

Mr Callinan said he would never say a member of An Garda Síochána was "not to be trusted", as alleged by John Deasy TD.

 

Misunderstanding

Mr Callinan said that before the PAC meeting, he met Seamus McCarthy, the Comptroller and Auditor General. Mr McCarthy asked Mr Callinan if Sgt McCabe was being investigated over a sexual allegation. Mr Callinan said he "corrected the record" that there was an investigation several years earlier and the DPP had indicated no prosecution.

Mr Callinan says that there must be "some misunderstanding" over what Mr McCarthy says he heard during this conversation, and that he was "mistaken" in terms of the interpretation of what was said on that occasion.

Tribunal barrister Patrick Marrinan SC said that four people were independently saying that Mr Callinan had made derogatory remarks about Sgt McCabe; journalist Philip Boucher Hayes, Mr McGuinness, Mr Deasy, and Mr McCarthy.

"Have you thought of any reason why all these people are lining up against you in this regard?" Mr Marrinan asked.

"All I can do is to provide to this tribunal the evidence that I have in relation to my interactions with each of these individuals," Mr Callinan said.

Mr Callinan also said it was "absolutely not the case" that former press officer Supt Taylor was directed "to brief the media that McCabe was motivated by maliciousness and revenge."